EU agrees to ban neonicotinoids

bookscook 27 April 2018

This is a response to this article:
[url=http://www.boerenbusiness.nl// artikel/10878366/eu-stemt-in-met-verbod-neonicotinoiden][/url]

Mrs. Schouten was probably the best and sweetest girl in the class. But as an advocate for Dutch agriculture totally unsuitable!!!
She's throwing the baby out with the bathwater!!! With her clumsy stupid act she saddles the sector with a big problem by not enforcing seed coatings for non-bee visited crops!!! She is doing the environment a great disservice!!! Or is it the intention that the possible alternatives also disappear and we just have to start biologically?
Then let them say it straight, but not about this stupid and underhanded stuff with which she outright fools the benevolent and thoughtful sector and puts it in its shirt. She knows even less about agriculture than her predecessor!!!

call 27 April 2018

why are the eu ministers trying so hard to destroy conventional agriculture in europe? Do they receive promises and funds from lobby groups (outside eu?), not purely for environmental reasons, otherwise it seems to me to be the only reason for their behaviour.

Jk 28 April 2018

Back to the dimethoate with an urgently required admission...

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freebooter 28 April 2018

Back to the Lindane.

MH 29 April 2018

The impact of a seed coating is extremely minimal compared to a necessary full-field spraying with considerably higher amounts of active substances, their volatilization and what about a higher drift risk, which will now become practice. Also MRL / Residue technically an incredibly bad decision. Alternatives are on the way, but this is too early for Dutch agriculture. Result ; The quality and yield of the crops are declining sharply. To prevent this as much as possible, larger amounts of active substances are used, which results in a higher environmental impact and greater risks for local residents and neighboring plots. This decision seems to be a completely politically driven emotion, the sector is not given the opportunity and the necessary time to develop and test the right alternatives.
In this way we have to wait for the very rapid disappearance of glyphosate and many other active substances without alternatives or alternatives that will be used en masse as a result and of which we do not even know whether they have sufficient effect and we do not even know what this means. will have an impact on, among other things, the environmental impact.

Together with this ban, there will also have to be a ban on products grown abroad that are on the shelves here in the Netherlands that have been treated with the recently or future banned substances and where there are no restrictions for money in those countries. Take a close look at various foreign fruit and vegetable crops and test them for residues and give open and honest information about all the results of these tests. And do this unannounced from the shelves in the supermarket. The Netherlands is really and rightly shocked by this.

We make it almost impossible for Dutch farmers and horticulturists to grow properly, let alone to make them financially positive. This while the Netherlands has an enormous agricultural reputation worldwide. Think of the breeding companies, universities and research companies.

Well done Netherlands. Doing well.

peer 29 April 2018

beet seed with insec costs 70 euros or more per pack an insec spraying costs between 7 and 12 euros so you can do a few sprays
the 2nd part of your argument makes sense if it is not allowed in this country, then you may not use the product that comes here either

Potter (gr) 29 April 2018

Since next year no more actara etc. may be used in the seed potatoes, we have to consider using mocap granulate against wireworms.
In addition, in some years the first aphids must be controlled with a killer/oil before the crop is closed. The effect against aphids has almost disappeared when the crop starts to flower. It sounds quite logical but it probably isn't.....
Making choices based on emotions and fear. Time will tell if it was a good decision.

Skirt 29 April 2018

Surprise? No, it fits in with the policy of marginalizing agriculture in NL in order to be able to claim at a later stage that it is a sector that is of little economic importance to NL. The next step will then be large-scale conversion into nature. You can call this expropriation through stifling regulations, this is a silent killer that has been at work for some time.

Peter34 29 April 2018

see it as an encouragement to get rid of chemistry. Who doesn't want that? But as long as the chemistry is available, it will be sold and used. Now looking for not just chemical agents.
LTO and others haven't really promoted voluntary renunciation of chemistry, have they? Baecke always followed the recommendations of the EFSA. And they have now (rara for me too) changed. Yet this is the science; which one, who's to say.
Was it (not) possible in the past, before the appearance of these agents, to grow crops? The resilience of soil, crops and the environment was greater in the past. That may be part of the solution.
Kjol, you can continue to wallow in misery, that's no solution.

hans 29 April 2018

Peter, of course it is possible to grow any crop without protection. Only, you can forget top yields with the chance of complete crop failures. Your price will not increase with less production, the border is always open. So with today's highly indebted agriculture, this option is not possible. The farmer and the bank are then at risk. Incidentally, Kjol is right, and he probably knows what the only remedy is, albeit for the first few.

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seagull 29 April 2018

Peter 34 , you also know that we used to use much heavier substances such as Lindane ?

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Skirt 29 April 2018

Peter 34 conveniently forgets the famines that used to be, of which the Phytoptora outbreak in Ireland is probably the best known, also ergot which decimated entire villages is not remembered, I'm almost sure they have never heard of this at all. The people who are far from reality see an Ot en Sien situation as the future, in that world does not fit electricity, luxury, cheap food, etc. But they do not want to give that up, no then it has to come from somewhere else and may everything that is prohibited here be applied there, that is, after all, free trade, that should not be tampered with, and it is no problem outside the eye of the spoiled NL/EU consumer. It's hypocrisy to the point. Years ago, Cosun asked the Ministry to investigate alternatives to neos. Was rejected, not considered important, and it wouldn't be banned anyway, see where we are now.

jpk 30 April 2018

These nicotines never come back with these active ingredients for the arable farmers which is the best strategy fruit cultivation will work from 2014 with the useful pest controllers works well against expectations

Arable Brabant 30 April 2018

what @peter34 says is only partly true.
If there is only organic cultivation, the disease pressure on all crops will be much greater.
conventional crops in addition to organic crops ensure that the diseases explode and spread less quickly. you have to see it as a kind of balance.

Einstein 30 April 2018

Also, don't forget that there are nearly 4 billion more mouths to feed since 1950.

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seagull 30 April 2018

what about flea collars for dogs and cats? I assume these will also be banned... I haven't read anything about it yet anyway

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captain gone 30 April 2018

seagull wrote:

what about flea collars for dogs and cats? I assume these will also be banned... I haven't read anything about it yet anyway

Ho ho Zeeuw that should not be talked about Marianne T her pussy must remain flea free.

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Marianne T's pussy 30 April 2018

What is this actually about?

rare 30 April 2018

by banning effective means, there will be less revenue.
as well as a warmer climate increases the pests on crops
=> farmers will have less return
=> the bank comes through the front door to collect everything, one less farmer
=> due to scarcity, food in the supermarket will become much more expensive, while the farmer will be squeezed even more
existing pesticides will become much more expensive (monsanto - bayer one firm)

Peter 34 1 May 2018

kjol wrote:

Peter 34 conveniently forgets the famines that used to be, of which the Phytoptora outbreak in Ireland is probably the best known, also ergot which decimated entire villages is not remembered, I'm almost sure they have never heard of this at all. The people who are far from reality see an Ot en Sien situation as the future, in that world does not fit electricity, luxury, cheap food, etc. But they do not want to give that up, no then it has to come from somewhere else and may everything that is prohibited here be applied there, that is, after all, free trade, that should not be tampered with, and it is no problem outside the eye of the spoiled NL/EU consumer. It's hypocrisy to the point. Years ago, Cosun asked the Ministry to investigate alternatives to neos. Was rejected, not considered important, and it wouldn't be banned anyway, see where we are now.

You have not experienced the time of Ot and Sien either. There was still something between that time and the year in which these neo-medicines, which are really not coming back, were released. Looking for alternatives, of which more resilience of soil and crops can be an important one. Be open to it and study it.
About the open borders, they are not a dogmatic principle for me. But that will depend on consumers and politicians.

Peter 34 1 May 2018

Einstein wrote:

Also, don't forget that there are nearly 4 billion more mouths to feed since 1950.

That's absolutely true. But you don't take that opportunity argument because it's close to your heart or because you, as a farmer, are bound to find a solution. Except in the transfer of technology and equipment (and even more of a change in mentality), the Dutch arable farming sector really can't do much about feeding all those mouths. We are much too small for that.

bookscook 1 May 2018

peter34 wrote:

Einstein wrote:
Also, don't forget that there are nearly 4 billion more mouths to feed since 1950.

That's absolutely true. But you don't take that opportunity argument because it's close to your heart or because you, as a farmer, are bound to find a solution. Except in the transfer of technology and equipment (and even more of a change in mentality), the Dutch arable farming sector really can't do much about feeding all those mouths. We are much too small for that.

@Peter: That's why the Netherlands is the second largest agricultural exporter in the world, because we are too small! And the contribution of these exports to the Dutch household book is also worthless, even if it becomes the largest when the gas tap is closed!

hans 1 May 2018

Peter, we're not too small, we're too expensive. Hunger is not a quantity problem, but a distribution problem. Commercial parties would rather sell for 1 cent more where it is lost, or for animal feed, than that they can save thousands of people from starvation. Trade has no feeling or face.

With regard to alternatives, of which more resilience of soil and crops can be important, who will start? certainly not the multinationals, they prefer to sell resources or seed that has to be bought and used every year, money is their only motivation. Look at the "drug" industry, nobody heals anymore, everyone is permanently on the medication.

Jan 1 May 2018

Shame this is destroying an entire agricultural branch.
What a minister we have I didn't think she was going with all the winds.
We must first withdraw all subsidies from those green parties, then they will beep differently.
This comes from their quiver,
We can immediately see whether she stands in front of us when we propose this to our minister.

Peter34 1 May 2018

@hans. 1.I totally agree with your first paragraph. I also think trade is absurd, has little logic, but does set the tone and rules.

2. alternatives. but why expect the renewal of big business? After all, you have your own soil, which you can improve. it does not have to come from a bag or a bottle.

@bookeskook that's a story about economics,
The fact that we are a major exporter does not say much about our production, only about surplus and commercial strength
I responded to the argument of world food supply, which is not (yet) a production problem. NL is too small for the solution.

Much agricultural trade has nothing to do with world food supplies. If roses are flown daily from Ethiopia via Aalsmeer to Oman, this shows a. the fun of that activity as well as b. the haze that a trade balance presents: economic stupidity.

bookscook 1 May 2018

@Peter; Economic stupidity characterizes your attitude. You think the money to maintain our society is growing in the wall! I can tell you it isn't! With that stupidity, euros flow into our public treasury with which they enable our society with the political choices for expenditure. So it's not that stupid.

peter34 1 May 2018

@bookeskook that there is more than money is clear from the reason for the ban on neonics. more such abuses will come out in the future, such as pointless flying because it would be good for economic development and because the consumer wants it. this is still possible because only part of the costs are charged. but if, for example, the insect world fails, the beeping will be different. and that may just be too late.
or do you really expect your salvation from technology and the chemical industry..... pollination robots on a drone or something?

https://www.nd.nl/nieuws/nederland/verbod-op-verbod-redt-insecten-niet.3003277.lynkx

bookscook 1 May 2018

The ban on neonics in flowering crops visited by bees is understandable, although the scientific evidence for a causal relationship to bee deaths has still not been provided! In fact, there are beekeepers who have always sent their colonies into the rapeseed fields and have no colon death problems. But the ban on this agent in seed coating of beets and onions that are not visited by bees is really very harmful to the environment and does nothing positive for the bee population.
And I also think it makes sense if you write on air travel forums with your knowledge.

Skirt 1 May 2018

People like Peter parasitize the wealth that is now built up, they add nothing to it, and thus undermine food safety and food security. Draw the line if these people like Peter 34 get their way in everything.

yellowar 1 May 2018

The humorless freeloaders of green peace are celebrating paid for by the postcode lottery.

agree 1 May 2018

@YELLOWAR Yes the lice in the fur are trying to shut this down paid by our society! This movement is starting to look like a sect that tries to disrupt society with a lot of money by brainwashing through the media controlled by them! Caroline van der Plas has laid out the lines in this beautifully. It's a shame that these lice are already heavily infiltrating politics with their army of lobbyists with their fake stories!

Peter34 2 May 2018

kjol wrote:

People like Peter parasitize the wealth that is now built up, they add nothing to it, and thus undermine food safety and food security. Draw the line if these people like Peter 34 get their way in everything.

rethink !

LLB 2 May 2018

So the fungicide coating in beet cultivation is over. I'd love to hear who wants to get rid of his LLBs

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Flevo outing 2 May 2018

LLB wrote:

So the fungicide coating in beet cultivation is over. I'd love to hear who wants to get rid of his LLBs

LLB, I hope you know more about LLBs than about pesticides...

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Fjdekruijf June 1, 2018

Mrs. Schouten is from the cu that is nothing more than green left with a bible in hand. She has already shown her true face twice. First by portraying all cattle farmers as criminal fraudsters and now again with the ban on neotics. All left deterrent policy of a bunch of environmental terrorists

roy June 2, 2018

@Peter34, you really don't get it at all. The Netherlands is really only a record exporter because quality is supplied. And now with the neo ban, that quality will decline and so the entire Dutch economy will be weakened. On to the Egyptian vegetables and Canadian seed potatoes. Will they be able to export this way in the near future? Good for the environment too. It is a great shame how Dutch agriculture is treated. It is one of the pillars of the Dutch economy, but none of the left-oriented media and organizations seem to understand that.

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Peter34 28 July 2018

roy wrote:

@Peter34, you really don't get it at all. The Netherlands is really only a record exporter because quality is supplied. And now with the neo ban, that quality will decline and so the entire Dutch economy will be weakened. On to the Egyptian vegetables and Canadian seed potatoes. Will they be able to export this way in the near future? Good for the environment too. It is a great shame how Dutch agriculture is treated. It is one of the pillars of the Dutch economy, but none of the left-oriented media and organizations seem to understand that.

peter34 28 July 2018

peter34 wrote:

roy wrote:
@Peter34, you really don't get it at all. The Netherlands is really only a record exporter because quality is supplied. And now with the neo ban, that quality will decline and so the entire Dutch economy will be weakened. On to the Egyptian vegetables and Canadian seed potatoes. Will they be able to export this way in the near future? Good for the environment too. It is a great shame how Dutch agriculture is treated. It is one of the pillars of the Dutch economy, but none of the left-oriented media and organizations seem to understand that.

Have you ever looked at how those figures came about, which resulted in a record position? could your foreign production traded here or in transit be part of that record as well? The way in which the economy is measured is already incomprehensible to a normal person: if you break down your car, it contributes to the economy, because the garage can write turnover. But the action itself is meaningless, does not contribute. Or do you think that's a sensible move. There are countless examples that make it impossible for me to understand why we should always be proud of growth (24/7) and records. The fact that I let the rat race pass me by is indeed a sign of my Bookeskook mentality. What's 'left' about that?
If you want to join the rat race is that right?

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arable farmer 5 September 2018

What surprises me that no one mentions that this is the same active ingredient that cats and dogs are used to treat against ticks and fleas. But of course we can't get there.

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