Greenpeace ruling a major blow to agriculture

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sefO 22 January 2025

This is in response to it Boerenbusiness article:
[url = https: // www.boerenbusiness.nl/artikel/10911696/greenpeace-uitspraak-grote-dreun-voor-landbouw]Greenpeace ruling a big blow to agriculture[/url]

Holman must have his ass kicked mercilessly, the BBB is doing everything it can to get unfeasible nitrogen rules adjusted, and that Holman, together with van Campen, is doing everything it can to thwart that, you would have voted for that Holman as a farmer. I hope that Keyzer, Wiersma and Rummenie will stand their ground and get the coalition on one to get the nitrogen law, contrived by the left, adjusted so that it becomes feasible, affordable and executable. BBB should not lend itself to destroying the sector, they should leave that to Holman.

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22 January 2025

If I have followed it correctly (and I have), then the intention is not to destroy the sector. The sector must continue in a different and inevitably slimmed-down way. With innovative tricks, almost everyone has had enough by now. The previous cabinet had a good plan and a generous budget. Little of all that remains due to your vain hopes (read: the mirages of the bbb). How are you going to solve this with common sense!?

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sefO 22 January 2025

If anything in the Netherlands needs to be built or renovated, first buy farmers, if new roads need to be built, first buy farmers, if the Netherlands wants to keep flying, first buy farmers, if nature is doing a bit worse somewhere (a hobbyhorse on the left), first buy farmers and I could go on like this for a while, that has nothing to do with a slimmed-down form, this is a demolition construction, nothing more and nothing less. We have reserved some money for you and now get the hell out, that was the D66 message that is increasingly taking shape.

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CM 22 January 2025

Do not cooperate. Make a law with other realistic standards and do not take nature as a starting point but put the own population at number 1. Housing construction, pass reporters and companies free rein. By the way, a 10 million fine is not something to lose sleep over and certainly do not pay to those green rascals.

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sefO 22 January 2025

I assume that BBB entered this coalition to achieve acceptable, feasible and affordable nitrogen regulations as a condition, all of this supported by the rest of the coalition, if not then it is ready for BBB I assume.

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time bomb 22 January 2025

Discussions will be needed here. The spokesman for housing is angry because the spokesman for agriculture wants to appeal. Talk!!. The entire agricultural product processors, as broadly as possible, must help out here. For example, the livestock farmers cannot do without the sugar industry, the chip processors cannot do without livestock farming, the brewers cannot do without livestock farming, residual products from consumer products such as chocolate. etc. Defense must invest ..% of the NBP in weapons. If all processing industries would, for example, create a kind of first aid for nitrogen problems. How is it in Belgium and Germany, will they continue like this, or is it already in order there, or does the Netherlands need to freshen up this air. The greens only care about 1 thing, whichever party, and that is LESS LIVESTOCK, also for animal welfare. We have 5 years. Not much, but not insurmountable. Let us all help, even if only mentally. I wrote a letter to NSC after the previous trick of lazy sjarel Holman. I also said that with that statement at the time, not much will remain of the NSC, only the bones. I wish the cabinet, and all who can do something for this difficult issue.

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donald 22 January 2025

I think it's beautiful. I hope the government closes everything for a week. Highways Schiphol Tata ban freight traffic ban dogs and cats. construction stops completely closes borders and then calls for new elections. I wonder what will happen then

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Green heart farmer. 22 January 2025

More manure, less floating manure. Arable farming can do with less artificial fertilizer. More green manure, less ploughing, more NKG.

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time bomb 22 January 2025

I can't find anything nice about this. It's been suggested many times. There are always frogs jumping out of the wheelbarrow. I would love to do nothing more. Negotiate and negotiate some more. Retail chains should be involved in this too.

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carolientje 22 January 2025

Just watch Wouter de Heij on YouTube. Someone with knowledge of the subject, will cost you 45 minutes of your life.

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not 22 January 2025

indeed carolientje everyone should take a look at this, including those pastry chefs in The Hague.

Keudeldoomke 22 January 2025

donald wrote:

I think it's beautiful. I hope the government closes everything for a week. Highways Schiphol Tata ban freight traffic ban dogs and cats. construction stops completely closes borders and then calls for new elections. I wonder what will happen then

I've come to the point where if you stop all human activity within a radius of 25 kilometers to remove most Natura 2000 areas, you will still have an overload according to current calculations.

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pass detector with 0.12mol deposition 22 January 2025

www.overijssel.notubiz.nl/meeting/1260209/Statencommissiedag_15-01-2025

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onion 22 January 2025

Paying a fine of 5 million over 10 years is the cheapest

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Jantje 23 January 2025

carolientje wrote:

Just watch Wouter de Heij on YouTube. Someone with knowledge of the subject, will cost you 45 minutes of your life.

Yes, interesting analysis. Using Aerius as a nitrogen model will lead to a new allowance affair that will make the current one pale in comparison.

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Arie poor branch. 23 January 2025

I understand all the commotion and my heart really lies with the farmers, but what everyone here forgets at the moment is that we also have to deal with Brussels. Despite much that you can say against the eu, that is a reality that we also cannot and do not want to miss. Something will really have to happen to keep things going.

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Full pants 23 January 2025

This action is simply a set-up. The result achieved was already reported on the Greenpeace website before the verdict. Everything to destroy agriculture.

loom 23 January 2025

nonsense arie, nothing at all should happen in agriculture, farmers added instead of removed yes! all that growing population must all eat.... we do not have to deal with Brussels we have created this problem which is not a problem ourselves if you point out 150 dots too much nature and say yourself can only emit a little mosquito poop then everything is too much, stay focused ej arie takkie and not hobble along like millions of meek sheep with their hooves down behind the pack. the farmers are ready in this discussion for the next 25 years investing in hot air. think of new grids new stables, buffer strips / green agents, edge caps drift-poor spraying / fertilization that the crop can no longer grow from etc etc etc etc. we as farmers have let ourselves be completely destroyed. now it's enough to lie down side by side in front of it, we're not doing anything anymore, billions are being passed on under the table by Carpenters to thwart and manipulate agriculture in Brussels and The Hague, it's been a big lie from the start and the sector that is best for nature is agriculture and that's being caught!!! Schiphol Tata traffic car roads etc. houses construction windmills solar panels on the ground discharge industry into open water open sewer medicine residues ecstasy in water?? everything is running smoothly that's possible........ but no we need the farmers sad sad arie I had estimated you much higher d66,er

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Arie poor branch. 23 January 2025

Lovely isn't it grower, to be so drained by the opinion of another, I hope it's a relief for you. I can agree with you on many things, but I still stand firmly behind what I wrote. And as far as politics are concerned, you're completely out of line. Good luck!!!.

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time bomb 23 January 2025

Arie poor branch. wrote:

I understand all the commotion and my heart really lies with the farmers, but what everyone here forgets at the moment is that we also have to deal with Brussels. Despite much that you can say against the eu, that is a reality that we also cannot and do not want to miss. Something will really have to happen to keep things going.

Core of truth. I have been to the livestock farming region on the Veluwe. There are a few places where the liquid manure literally and figuratively runs out of the spouts, but this does not have to lead to very large shifts. There will certainly be companies that experience this, that want to be of good will. I do think that they should stay away from the latent nitrogen.

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Blinkers 23 January 2025

There are too many people living in this country, 12 million is the max (Club of Rome in the 60s).

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Arie poor branch 23 January 2025

blinkers wrote:

There are too many people living in this country, 12 million is the max (Club of Rome in the 60s).

What now?

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Term 23 January 2025

CM wrote:

Do not cooperate. Make a law with other realistic standards and do not take nature as a starting point but put the own population at number 1. Housing construction, pass reporters and companies free rein. By the way, a 10 million fine is not something to lose sleep over and certainly do not pay to those green rascals.

Greenpeace, MOB and those other idiots can do a lot of damage to society with 10 million.

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Term 23 January 2025

Arie poor branch wrote:

blinkers wrote:
There are too many people living in this country, 12 million is the max (Club of Rome in the 60s).
What now?

Set up a buy-back scheme and clean-up? Everything for nature.

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Blinkers 23 January 2025

Arie poor branch wrote:

blinkers wrote:
There are too many people living in this country, 12 million is the max (Club of Rome in the 60s).
What now?

This cannot be solved because the population continues to grow and the pressure on nature will only increase.

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23 January 2025

This morning I read in the Brabants-Dagblad: "If political amateurism and administrative ignorance are the order of the day, it is of course not surprising that a judge has to intervene". Let this sink in for a moment. Please don't take it amiss. I didn't make it up, but it is what has been at the root of all the commotion since yesterday

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Blinkers 23 January 2025

wrote:

This morning I read in the Brabants-Dagblad: "If political amateurism and administrative ignorance are the order of the day, it is of course not surprising that a judge has to intervene". Let this sink in for a moment. Please don't take it amiss. I didn't make it up, but it is what has been at the root of all the commotion since yesterday

Yes, and don't forget the word ignorance.

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Blinkers 23 January 2025

wrote:

This morning I read in the Brabants-Dagblad: "If political amateurism and administrative ignorance are the order of the day, it is of course not surprising that a judge has to intervene". Let this sink in for a moment. Please don't take it amiss. I didn't make it up, but it is what has been at the root of all the commotion since yesterday

Yes, and don't forget the word ignorance.

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CM 23 January 2025

term wrote:

CM wrote:
Do not cooperate. Make a law with other realistic standards and do not take nature as a starting point but put the own population at number 1. Housing construction, pass reporters and companies free rein. By the way, a 10 million fine is not something to lose sleep over and certainly do not pay to those green rascals.
Greenpeace, MOB and those other idiots can do a lot of damage to society with 10 million.

Pay 10 million, but not to those activists and unlock the whole thing. You can completely ignore the statements of the Council of State. Build as much as you want, what is standing and inhabited will not be demolished. Do not consult officials of LNV but set rules in a law yourself, with realistic standards, see vd Heij. Scrap Aerius because of assumptions.

connoisseur 23 January 2025

cm you still believe in fairy tales you always pay at least 10 million to those activists because left or right the state is/are awake animals/green peach etc see message Timmermans simply went directly from the climate ministry pot to these clubs it is all the same this outcome had to be it at all costs. just watch out d66 will simply be right halving agro at all costs.....

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time bomb 23 January 2025

blinkers wrote:

There are too many people living in this country, 12 million is the max (Club of Rome in the 60s).

What to do with the surplus, or should we emigrate now. Still, there must be food, and as cheap as possible. Greens manage the Netherlands, but if you see the % green in the room, it is only a handful, but the meanest face. The Netherlands must become 1 large nature reserve.

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Blinkers 23 January 2025

time bomb wrote:

blinkers wrote:
There are too many people living in this country, 12 million is the max (Club of Rome in the 60s).
What to do with the surplus, or should we emigrate now. Still, there must be food, and as cheap as possible. Greens manage the Netherlands, but if you see the % green in the room, it is only a handful, but the meanest face. The Netherlands must become 1 large nature reserve.

What I mean is that there are now +/- 18 million people living in the Netherlands and if you believe the scientists that there will be more than 20 million within 20 years. The question is and remains, the livestock must shrink while the population increases that has to live, work and recreate, what is the environmental benefit, especially if the houses are built on agricultural land? I dare to say that humans cause more environmental damage than a few cows or sheep walking in a meadow.

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simple farmer 23 January 2025

It is to be hoped that Mrs. Wiersma does not throw in the towel. It is a severe test that she must undergo. She will still obtain that derogation if she can keep it up.

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23 January 2025

yes indeed, for someone with charm but otherwise without any relevant education and experience who is in fact totally unsuitable for such a function, it will undoubtedly be a severe test to have to perform at a ministerial level. You don't want to think about it.... Throwing in the towel is, however, a solution to put an end to this torment from a self-protection perspective.

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time bomb 23 January 2025

blinkers wrote:

time bomb wrote:
blinkers wrote:
There are too many people living in this country, 12 million is the max (Club of Rome in the 60s).
What to do with the surplus, or should we emigrate now. Still, there must be food, and as cheap as possible. Greens manage the Netherlands, but if you see the % green in the room, it is only a handful, but the meanest face. The Netherlands must become 1 large nature reserve.
What I mean is that there are now +/- 18 million people living in the Netherlands and if you believe the scientists that there will be more than 20 million within 20 years. The question is and remains, the livestock must shrink while the population increases that has to live, work and recreate, what is the environmental benefit, especially if the houses are built on agricultural land? I dare to say that humans cause more environmental damage than a few cows or sheep walking in a meadow.

I completely agree with you. Protesting will not work. But the government is simply taking good agricultural land out of production. Defence will also have to go to good agricultural land. Everything depends on nature. Unfairly divided. If the farmer has to make concessions, so must nature, construction, flight movements, chemical factories, and so on. Something has to be done, that much is clear, but there are many innovation possibilities if you read it like this, but it costs quite a lot of money, and the government is not going to help finance this, because agriculture in general has to go. Together with producing, processing, transporting and so on, we will have to take this under our own management, so that we do not need the government. Even stronger: We have to eliminate them. That way we can become and remain strong, and comply with the rules. We are too bothered by politics. We have to try to get a jealous political The Hague through our own efforts. We are too dependent, and they abuse that in The Hague. We have to become autonomous.

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Arie poor branch. 23 January 2025

In-house, can we meet these rules? What rules are you thinking of and who makes those rules? If that is the us you mean, we will certainly succeed.

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time bomb 23 January 2025

Arie poor branch. wrote:

In-house, can we meet these rules? What rules are you thinking of and who makes those rules? If that is the us you mean, we will certainly succeed.

We will have to comply with European regulations. What has the government already achieved? Comply with the allowance rights, natural gas Groningen. They are always too late or too early, but never on time. As Dutch agriculture, we must make a big fist with everything on it. Taking to the streets (I liked doing it) does not help in a positive sense. Euros will be a very big obstacle. We have also always adopted a wait-and-see attitude, so they did what they wanted. Take control into their own hands. They should not decide on our business operations. Make sure that we have things in order, and do not change the rules during the game. Make good agreements

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frans 23 January 2025

just pay the 10 million and move on.

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CM 23 January 2025

kennert wrote:

cm you still believe in fairy tales you always pay at least 10 million to those activists because left or right the state is/are awake animals/green peach etc see message Timmermans simply went directly from the climate ministry pot to these clubs it is all the same this outcome had to be it at all costs. just watch out d66 will simply be right halving agro at all costs.....

Well, you're not such an expert. D66 can shout all sorts of things but you shouldn't listen to them. Introduce new rules in the law and ignore the Council of State and certainly not EUROPE. If it suits you, other countries such as Poland, Hungary, France, Italy and Greece, for example, will go their own way. You don't let your own country be destroyed. Recalibration of Natura 200, Norm N, Aerius and so on. Don't be afraid but do as Trump does. Own country first and continue.

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time bomb 23 January 2025

You can't compare America to the Netherlands. Now the news says that the approach to nitrogen in agriculture can be a blessing for construction. Over the farmers' backs again.

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CM 23 January 2025

No, this is not America but it is about what do you want. Do you let your own country be destroyed by nature freaks or not. I personally do not have that much trouble with it but that does not mean that it can just continue with the BV Netherlands. Our own people first is a loaded slogan but it should be the starting point.

connoisseur 23 January 2025

that's me you can't listen to d66 but that's bullshit. these agendas are so powerful and intertwined there's so much more behind it than you think. hope state aid under the table by brainwashing citizens to get cultured meat no more animals no more conventional agriculture everything to organic and vertical farming so that everything is centrally pushed through the straw. it's a preconceived plan to ruin everything and make everyone dependent on the state green left d66 party for the animals 80% of the judges are from these clubs and then you can guess the outcome!! hope there will be a big turnaround but fear the worst if we could just farm like say 20 years ago it was a godsend but there are other interests at play,

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CM 23 January 2025

What do we want then, no Forum because that cookie baker is off the path. But you can expect absolutely nothing from Left, D66, CU, CDA, NSC. VVD is hesitant, BBB wants but does not deliver yet. PVV is still most clear about what they want and is not the be-all and end-all but for me the least bad.

connoisseur 23 January 2025

I agree with you! Only Mr. Gray is still a thing with his animal phobia

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time bomb 23 January 2025

CM wrote:

What do we want then, no Forum because that cookie baker is off the path. But you can expect absolutely nothing from Left, D66, CU, CDA, NSC. VVD is hesitant, BBB wants but does not deliver yet. PVV is still most clear about what they want and is not the be-all and end-all but for me the least bad.

This coalition has a very shaky crippled base, and the opposition knows that very well. A purple coalition is a solution, but getting it together will not be easy. If there were elections now, it would not be possible without the PVV. That would only be possible with the PVD, SP, Volt. Denk, and then together with the VVD, CDA and CU. A new coalition would not be easy to realize now. Our strategy must come from the bottom up

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CM 23 January 2025

kennert wrote:

I agree with you! Only Mr. Gray is still a thing with his animal phobia

We appoint Grauss as wolf chaser. Kss, kss and they're gone :)

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Arie poor branch 23 January 2025

blinkers wrote:

There are too many people living in this country, 12 million is the max (Club of Rome in the 60s).

What now?

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Blinkers 24 January 2025

Arie poor branch wrote:

blinkers wrote:
There are too many people living in this country, 12 million is the max (Club of Rome in the 60s).
What now?

There was a documentary on TV a few weeks ago about the earth being overpopulated. A number of experts/scholars stated that a population of 2 billion people on this earth was the limit to not burden the earth any further. It is a number that you can discuss but if you translate this to the Netherlands for example, the population here would be a maximum of 5 million people. Many problems would then solve themselves.

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Blinkers 24 January 2025

Arie poor branch wrote:

blinkers wrote:
There are too many people living in this country, 12 million is the max (Club of Rome in the 60s).
What now?

There was a documentary on TV a few weeks ago about the earth being overpopulated. A number of experts/scholars stated that a population of 2 billion people on this earth was the limit to not burden the earth any further. It is a number that you can discuss but if you translate this to the Netherlands for example, the population here would be a maximum of 5 million people. Many problems would then solve themselves.

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time bomb 24 January 2025

blinkers wrote:

Arie poor branch wrote:
blinkers wrote:
There are too many people living in this country, 12 million is the max (Club of Rome in the 60s).
What now?
There was a documentary on TV a few weeks ago about the earth being overpopulated. A number of experts/scholars stated that a population of 2 billion people on this earth was the limit to not burden the earth any further. It is a number that you can discuss but if you translate this to the Netherlands for example, the population here would be a maximum of 5 million people. Many problems would then solve themselves.

I have also written what we should do with the surplus. That is the government's problem, isn't it, and not the farmer's? And there are also others that everyone has and may have their respected opinion about. Salted or unsalted. And yet the government says that companies from abroad are very welcome. Farmers reduce? Then other companies too, who then perhaps bring even more people (N) here.

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CM 24 January 2025

It is actually very simple. Who has a lot of space in use as a professional group? Precisely the farmers. So who is looked at by politics, builders of roads and houses, nature organizations, defense, data centers and so on. Food should not cost too much and the world is 1 big market economy.

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Ruud 24 January 2025

The agricultural sector is the only one that can turn the nitrogen deposition into value to grow plants on it, which resident, industry or sector can do that after us? We only get the shit from them.

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Sea buckthorn 26 January 2025

Today I'm going to read the nitrogen trap by Aarnoud Jaspers again. Two years ago politics also calmed down after the publication of this book. maybe they should read it again.

calculator 26 January 2025

blinkers wrote:

Arie poor branch wrote:
blinkers wrote:
There are too many people living in this country, 12 million is the max (Club of Rome in the 60s).
What now?
There was a documentary on TV a few weeks ago about the earth being overpopulated. A number of experts/scholars stated that a population of 2 billion people on this earth was the limit to not burden the earth any further. It is a number that you can discuss but if you translate this to the Netherlands for example, the population here would be a maximum of 5 million people. Many problems would then solve themselves.

The sector that would have the biggest problem if there were 3/4 fewer people? Agriculture of course. Then suddenly 3/4 of our sales are gone while the surface of agricultural land is still the same. I don't see how that would fall into the category "many problems would solve themselves".

calculator 26 January 2025

The sector that would have the biggest problem if there were 3/4 fewer people? Agriculture of course. Then suddenly 3/4 of our sales are gone while the surface of agricultural land is still the same. I don't see how that would fall into the category "many problems would solve themselves".

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Jantje 26 January 2025

Sea buckthorn wrote:

Today I'm going to read the nitrogen trap by Aarnoud Jaspers again. Two years ago politics also calmed down after the publication of this book. maybe they should read it again.

Read this: commentary by Arnout Jaspers https://www.wyniasweek.nl/de-overwinning-van-greenpeace-bij-de-rechtbank-in-den-haag-is-een-lege-huls/

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